Discussion:
Hercules Linux integrated console
(too old to reply)
Benjamin Huntsman
2011-12-13 18:29:35 UTC
Permalink
Is there a way to attach a real terminal emulator like PuTTY or something to Hercules and use that
during IPL/installation, instead of the integrated console thing? If so, can someone provide a
quick config file example?

Many thanks!!
Rene Ferland
2011-12-13 18:57:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Is there a way to attach a real terminal emulator like PuTTY or something to Hercules and use that
during IPL/installation, instead of the integrated console thing? If so, can someone provide a
quick config file example?
Can you start a simple telnet session with PuTTY ?

Rene FERLAND
Benjamin Huntsman
2011-12-13 19:05:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Ferland
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Is there a way to attach a real terminal emulator like PuTTY or something to Hercules and use that
during IPL/installation, instead of the integrated console thing? If so, can someone provide a
quick config file example?
Can you start a simple telnet session with PuTTY ?
Sure, but the IPL messages still go to the Hercules console, not the telnet client...
Rene Ferland
2011-12-13 20:00:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Rene Ferland
Can you start a simple telnet session with PuTTY ?
Sure, but the IPL messages still go to the Hercules console, not the telnet client...
Okay then, how about you edit your Hercules config file, changing a console line like

009 3215-C NOPROMPT

to

009 3215 NOPROMPT

instead (removing the "-C"). Then you start Hercules, connect with PuTTY, and IPL ? You should then get the messages in your telnet session.

Would that be useful for you ?

Regards,

Rene
somitcw
2011-12-13 20:14:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Rene Ferland
Can you start a simple telnet session with PuTTY ?
Sure, but the IPL messages still go to the Hercules
console, not the telnet client...
Okay then, how about you edit your Hercules config
file, changing a console line like
009 3215-C NOPROMPT
to
009 3215 NOPROMPT
instead (removing the "-C"). Then you start Hercules,
connect with PuTTY, and IPL ? You should then get the
messages in your telnet session.
Would that be useful for you ?
Regards,
Rene
That change to 0009 would be related to the Hercules
integrated console but I think that the question is
somehow related to not using the SysCons interface or
switching to the HTTPPORT instead?
Benjamin Huntsman
2011-12-13 20:25:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Ferland
Okay then, how about you edit your Hercules config file, changing a console line like
009 3215-C NOPROMPT
to
009 3215 NOPROMPT
instead (removing the "-C"). Then you start Hercules, connect with PuTTY, and IPL ? You should then get the messages in your telnet session.
Would that be useful for you ?
Regards,
Rene
Yes, that's exactly what I *want* to have happen, but even though I have a telnet session attached to 0009, defined as a 3215 (not -C), the
output still goes to the Hercules console.

Gregg mentioned something about "it depends on what you're running your Hercules arrangements on". Not sure what's meant by that. This
is an amd64 box running Windows XP Professional x64 Edition, and a 64-bit copy of Hercules I compiled from source. Just for the sake of
completeness, here's my config:

#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# CPU Configuration
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CPUSERIAL 000001 # CPU serial number
MODEL EMULATOR # STSI returned model
PLANT ZZ # STSI returned plant
MANUFACTURER HRC # STSI returned manufacturer
LPARNAME lpar0 # DIAG 204 returned lparname
CPUVERID FD # CPU Version Identification
MAINSIZE 1024 # Main storage size in megabytes
# XPNDSIZE 256 # Expanded storage size in megabytes
NUMCPU 1 # Number of CPUs
# NUMVEC 1 # Number of Vector Processors
MAXCPU 8 # Maximum number of CPUs
# ENGINES CP # CP=cpu, AP=zAAP, IP=zIIP, IL=IFL (Linux)
ARCHMODE ESA/390 # Architecture mode S/370, ESA/390 or z/Arch
ALRF ENABLE # ASN-and-LX-Reuse facility
ECPSVM NO # VM Assist : NO or Level (20 recommended)

#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# OS Tailoring
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------

# LOADPARM 0120.... # IPL parameter
OSTAILOR Linux # OS tailoring
SYSEPOCH 1900 # Base year for initial TOD clock
# TZOFFSET 0 # Using UTC (GMT)


#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Hercules Service Processor and Hercules Application Window
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------


MODPATH C:\VPC\VM\Linux390\bin # Where to search for modules
LDMOD dyninst # Modules to be loaded

#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Hercules Service Processor and Hercules Application Window
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CODEPAGE default # CodePage conversion table
DIAG8CMD disable # OS may not issue commands via DIAG 8

HTTPPORT 8081 noauth userid password # HTTP server port
# HTTPROOT /usr/local/share/hercules/ # HTTP root directory

PANRATE FAST # Panel refresh rate


#-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Advanced Hercules Performance Tailoring
#
# +----------------------------------------------------------------+
# | Caution: Modification of these parameters may adversely |
# | affect the performance of the host system |
# | and/or Hercules. |
# +----------------------------------------------------------------+
#-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HERCPRIO 15 # Set to "Below Normal"
# CPUPRIO 15 # CPU thread(s) run at Low priority
# DEVPRIO 8 # Device thread(s) run at Below Normal priority
# TODPRIO -20 # TOD Clock and timer thread are Time Critical


#-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Integrated Hercules I/O Controller
#

# DEVTMAX 0 # Device threads, 8 on Windows, else unlimited
CNSLPORT 3270 # TCP port number to which consoles connect
# SHRDPORT 3990 # TCP port number for sharing DASD images on
# this instance of Hercules (inactive)

# .-----------------------Device number
# | .-----------------Device type
# | | .---------File name and parameters
# | | |
# V V V
# ---- ---- --------------------
# 001F 3270

# 000C 3505
000E 1403 prt00e.txt noclear

0009 3215 NOPROMPT

0581 3490


As you can see, 0009 is a 3215, not 3215-C, and when I connect to it via a terminal emulator, it gets the Hercules message indicating
it's device 0009, and yet, the IPL messages an initial Linux shell still go to the Hercules screen. Did I forget something during the
compile of the binaries?

Thanks!

-Ben
Gregg Levine
2011-12-13 20:55:56 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 3:25 PM, Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Rene Ferland
Okay then, how about you edit your Hercules config file, changing a console line like
009 3215-C NOPROMPT
to
009 3215 NOPROMPT
instead (removing the "-C"). Then you start Hercules, connect with PuTTY, and IPL ? You should then get the messages in your telnet session.
Would that be useful for you ?
Regards,
Rene
Yes, that's exactly what I *want* to have happen, but even though I have a telnet session attached to 0009, defined as a 3215 (not -C), the
output still goes to the Hercules console.
Gregg mentioned something about "it depends on what you're running your Hercules arrangements on".  Not sure what's meant by that.  This
is an amd64 box running Windows XP Professional x64 Edition, and a 64-bit copy of Hercules I compiled from source.  Just for the sake of
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#       CPU Configuration
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 CPUSERIAL 000001              # CPU serial number
 MODEL     EMULATOR            # STSI returned model
 PLANT     ZZ                  # STSI returned plant
 MANUFACTURER HRC              # STSI returned manufacturer
 LPARNAME  lpar0               # DIAG 204 returned lparname
 CPUVERID  FD                  # CPU Version Identification
 MAINSIZE  1024                # Main storage size in megabytes
# XPNDSIZE  256                 # Expanded storage size in megabytes
 NUMCPU    1                   # Number of CPUs
# NUMVEC    1                   # Number of Vector Processors
 MAXCPU    8                   # Maximum number of CPUs
# ENGINES   CP                  # CP=cpu, AP=zAAP, IP=zIIP, IL=IFL (Linux)
 ARCHMODE  ESA/390             # Architecture mode S/370, ESA/390 or z/Arch
 ALRF      ENABLE              # ASN-and-LX-Reuse facility
 ECPSVM    NO                  # VM Assist : NO or Level (20 recommended)
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#       OS Tailoring
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# LOADPARM  0120....            # IPL parameter
 OSTAILOR  Linux               # OS tailoring
 SYSEPOCH  1900                # Base year for initial TOD clock
# TZOFFSET  0                   # Using UTC (GMT)
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#       Hercules Service Processor and Hercules Application Window
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 MODPATH   C:\VPC\VM\Linux390\bin         # Where to search for modules
 LDMOD     dyninst                     # Modules to be loaded
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#       Hercules Service Processor and Hercules Application Window
#------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 CODEPAGE  default                     # CodePage conversion table
 DIAG8CMD  disable                     # OS may not issue commands via DIAG 8
 HTTPPORT  8081 noauth userid password # HTTP server port
# HTTPROOT  /usr/local/share/hercules/  # HTTP root directory
 PANRATE   FAST                        # Panel refresh rate
#-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#       Advanced Hercules Performance Tailoring
#
#       +----------------------------------------------------------------+
#       | Caution:  Modification of these parameters may adversely       |
#       |           affect the performance of the host system            |
#       |           and/or Hercules.                                     |
#       +----------------------------------------------------------------+
#-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 HERCPRIO   15                 # Set to "Below Normal"
# CPUPRIO    15                 # CPU thread(s) run at Low priority
# DEVPRIO     8                 # Device thread(s) run at Below Normal priority
# TODPRIO   -20                 # TOD Clock and timer thread are Time Critical
#-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#       Integrated Hercules I/O Controller
#
# DEVTMAX      0                # Device threads, 8 on Windows, else unlimited
 CNSLPORT  3270                # TCP port number to which consoles connect
# SHRDPORT  3990                # TCP port number for sharing DASD images on
                               # this instance of Hercules (inactive)
#   .-----------------------Device number
#   |     .-----------------Device type
#   |     |       .---------File name and parameters
#   |     |       |
#   V     V       V
# ----    ----    --------------------
# 001F    3270
# 000C    3505
 000E    1403    prt00e.txt noclear
 0009    3215    NOPROMPT
 0581    3490
As you can see, 0009 is a 3215, not 3215-C, and when I connect to it via a terminal emulator, it gets the Hercules message indicating
it's device 0009, and yet, the IPL messages an initial Linux shell still go to the Hercules screen.  Did I forget something during the
compile of the binaries?
Thanks!
-Ben
------------------------------------
Hello!
What I stated was a variation on a theme of "It depends.", that's an
almost copyrighted phrase used by an IBMer to describe what can
happen. Ideally it depends on what you are using as your host. You are
using a copy of XP that was targeted almost exclusively towards
individuals who wanted to start participating in a trend, that of 64
bit software on the Intel and then AMD platforms. It was not properly
marketed and was largely made available via MSDN and some specialty
houses, including school bookstores.

Which by the way now brings me to what did you use to build your
release of Hercules, was it a copy of VS? If so which one? There is an
interesting explanation on the Cygwin site regarding what it is, and
sadly what it is not.

I should also mention that I am not an expert in the way Hercules does
its thing. Only a capable (within reason) user. As for what its
hosting on, the clew was in your mentioning the telnet client that
Windows has.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8-***@public.gmane.org
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
Benjamin Huntsman
2011-12-13 21:56:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gregg Levine
Which by the way now brings me to what did you use to build your
release of Hercules, was it a copy of VS? If so which one? There is an
interesting explanation on the Cygwin site regarding what it is, and
sadly what it is not.
VS2008. XP x64 Edition is basically Server 2003 x64. The kernels are identical and some
pieces of software will even detect it as Server 2003 instead of XP x64. Regardless, I can't
image that would make any difference on the console issue. VS, maybe...

But, it's looking like there's no way architecturally in Hercules to define a boot console for
Linux other than the built-in SCLP SysCons...

Thanks!

-Ben
Ivan Warren
2011-12-13 22:55:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
But, it's looking like there's no way architecturally in Hercules to define a boot console for
Linux other than the built-in SCLP SysCons...
Not an hercules issue per-se... It's all about how linux decides it
wants to interact with the operator.

Anyone tried condev=CCUU and conmode=3215 as boot parameters ? (be it
through the parm file on a tape/card boot or within zipl ?)

--Ivan
Rene Ferland
2011-12-13 20:58:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
As you can see, 0009 is a 3215, not 3215-C, and when I connect to it via a terminal emulator, it gets the Hercules message indicating
it's device 0009, and yet, the IPL messages an initial Linux shell still go to the Hercules screen. Did I forget something during the
compile of the binaries?
Oh I see ... I thought your were running VM or MVS under Hercules under Linux. But apparently you run Linux native under Hercules (or maybe Linux under VM under Hercules). That is different. I installed one Linux system native under Hercules and indeed, that Linux used the Hercules console as its "boot" console (with commands preceded by a dot). I do not know how to separate the two (actually I never tried to). I am not sure the answer to your problem is in Hercules or its config file though. I would look on the Linux side because at boot time how much does Linux know about the hardware configuration of the emulated mainframe ?

I am sorry I can not be of more help.

Good luck,

Rene
Benjamin Huntsman
2011-12-13 22:09:40 UTC
Permalink
Nope, 64-bit Hercules under Windows XP x64. Linux (SLES 9 s390) on Hercules in ESA/390 mode. Wanting to not use the
SysCons/SCLP console (or whatever it's called).

But yes, as Hercules is an emulator, there's got to be a way to define what the boot console is on a real piece of hardware,
which should work for it as well. Does Linux/390 default to using 0009? All this is just test/prep work before I try it on a
(mostly) real piece of hardware: my P/390. Can the console be specified to the Linux IPL text via IPLPARM or something?

Thanks again!

-Ben
Mike Schwab
2011-12-13 22:35:51 UTC
Permalink
Have you tried the 0000 SYSG console that z/VM uses?

On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 4:09 PM, Benjamin Huntsman
Nope, 64-bit Hercules under Windows XP x64.  Linux (SLES 9 s390) on Hercules in ESA/390 mode.  Wanting to not use the
SysCons/SCLP console (or whatever it's called).
But yes, as Hercules is an emulator, there's got to be a way to define what the boot console is on a real piece of hardware,
which should work for it as well.  Does Linux/390 default to using 0009?  All this is just test/prep work before I try it on a
(mostly) real piece of hardware: my P/390.  Can the console be specified to the Linux IPL text via IPLPARM or something?
Thanks again!
-Ben
--
Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA
Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all?
"Fish" (David B. Trout)
2012-01-02 06:39:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Schwab
Have you tried the 0000 SYSG console that z/VM uses?
Seconded.

I believe this is actually what the OP wants, and what I believe *should*
probably work (although I have not verified it).
--
"Fish" (David B. Trout)
fish-VLFb7ALKWJGGw+***@public.gmane.org




------------------------------------
Gregg Levine
2011-12-13 19:07:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rene Ferland
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Is there a way to attach a real terminal emulator like PuTTY or something to Hercules and use that
during IPL/installation, instead of the integrated console thing?  If so, can someone provide a
quick config file example?
Can you start a simple telnet session with PuTTY ?
Rene FERLAND
Hello!
Actually PuTTY contains both an integrated SSH console (which most of
us use it for) and a serial one for external serial ports, and a
telnet one. Part of the problem is that telnet is decided insecure.

There are of course other issues.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8-***@public.gmane.org
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
Benjamin Huntsman
2011-12-13 19:15:01 UTC
Permalink
Yes, PuTTY can connect via many different ways. In this case, I just threw it out there because it's better than the stock
Windows telnet client, and free. At the end of the day though, I'll probably use my licensed copy of WRQ Reflection, but
I figured less people on this list would be familiar with it. If you really want to have fun on Windows though, you should
check out PuTTYcyg, which includes the ability to replace the Windows CMD.EXE window... but I digress.

The point in the end though is to not have to get through the netsetup stuff using the integrated Hercules console and
preceding all commands with a ., especially in this case, because the scripts in the tapeipl from my SLES 9 iso are referring
to the wrong directories. I'd patch it up with sed, but pipes and redirect don't work well through the integrated console...

Thanks!
Gregg Levine
2011-12-13 19:20:13 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 2:15 PM, Benjamin Huntsman
Yes, PuTTY can connect via many different ways.  In this case, I just threw it out there because it's better than the stock
Windows telnet client, and free.  At the end of the day though, I'll probably use my licensed copy of WRQ Reflection, but
I figured less people on this list would be familiar with it.  If you really want to have fun on Windows though, you should
check out PuTTYcyg, which includes the ability to replace the Windows CMD.EXE window... but I digress.
The point in the end though is to not have to get through the netsetup stuff using the integrated Hercules console and
preceding all commands with a ., especially in this case, because the scripts in the tapeipl from my SLES 9 iso are referring
to the wrong directories.  I'd patch it up with sed, but pipes and redirect don't work well through the integrated console...
Thanks!
Hello!
Actually that fork of the PuTTY code was arranged to make it possible
to connect it to the Cygwin mechanism that most of us started with for
running Hercules. I've also used Putty itself to connect via SSH to
the Cygwin stuff, and certainly via telnet for Hercules.

-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8-***@public.gmane.org
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
Benjamin Huntsman
2011-12-13 19:36:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gregg Levine
Hello!
Actually that fork of the PuTTY code was arranged to make it possible
to connect it to the Cygwin mechanism that most of us started with for
running Hercules. I've also used Putty itself to connect via SSH to
the Cygwin stuff, and certainly via telnet for Hercules.
So then are you saying that the integrated Hercules console is the only option while kicking
off the Linux installation, and that the only halfway-decent way to improve the experience
is to use PuTTYcyg?

Thanks!
Gregg Levine
2011-12-13 19:44:08 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 2:36 PM, Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Gregg Levine
Hello!
Actually that fork of the PuTTY code was arranged to make it possible
to connect it to the Cygwin mechanism that most of us started with for
running Hercules. I've also used Putty itself to connect via SSH to
the Cygwin stuff, and certainly via telnet for Hercules.
So then are you saying that the integrated Hercules console is the only option while kicking
off the Linux installation, and that the only halfway-decent way to improve the experience
is to use PuTTYcyg?
Thanks!
------------------------------------
Hello!
It really depends on what you are running your Hercules arrangement on.
--
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8-***@public.gmane.org
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
Harold Grovesteen
2011-12-14 10:22:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gregg Levine
On Tue, Dec 13, 2011 at 2:36 PM, Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Benjamin Huntsman
Post by Gregg Levine
Hello!
Actually that fork of the PuTTY code was arranged to make it possible
to connect it to the Cygwin mechanism that most of us started with for
running Hercules. I've also used Putty itself to connect via SSH to
the Cygwin stuff, and certainly via telnet for Hercules.
So then are you saying that the integrated Hercules console is the only option while kicking
off the Linux installation, and that the only halfway-decent way to improve the experience
is to use PuTTYcyg?
Thanks!
------------------------------------
Hello!
It really depends on what you are running your Hercules arrangement on.
The issue of what console is used by the Linux installer is not
controlled by Hercules or what Telnet client is used. The installation
process in Linux is driven by a distribution supplied program called the
installer. How it is programmed drives the console device option?

Ivan Warren's suggestion of a parm card is the best bet at changing the
console device of the installer to a 3215 console that will not require
a dot before the input and yes will use a Telnet client. But it starts
with Linux, not the Hercules configuration.

Harold Grovesteen
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